NP: Wire - Low Done
A thread about music elitists bashing others for their music taste made me think of how anonymity encourages people to be rude to others. People say really offensive things they would not tell anyone else in real life.
Does anyone else have anything to aggregate onto this? Do you think this problem is chronic and affecting the youth (and adults?) of today? A solution to it?
http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/2008-05-15-myspace-suicide_N.htm
That's an example of the causes of cyberbullying.
I was talking about this with a friend and he made very valid points.
We're in an age where internet is actually serious business. People do their banking on the internet, fall in love on the internet, order prescription drugs on the internet, etc.
How is a rude act dismissed just because it was made online?
Muy Bueno
ReplyDeleteWell, the problem is not in the Internet, but in the people themselves. Internet provides the means for cyberbullying, but if people weren't inclined to be rude in the first place, they wouldn't be rude on the internet either.
ReplyDeleteOf course, violations shouldn't be dismissed, no matter whether they are made online or not.
As the use of the internet increases, so will computer crimes. And so will enforcing the laws concerning those crimes.
PS About the so called "elitists" - they are ridiculous and cannot insult anyone so much as they do insult themselves.
Anyone considering himself/herself part of some elite, being it intellectual or artistic should have at least some style and manners. And flamers do not.
Television and Newspapers dismiss the internet as unimportant because they're threatened by the internet. Because of that, a large portion of the population still sees the internet as being a sandbox for weirdos, which is precisely why they're so shocked when a "normal" person hurts another "normal" person over the internet.
ReplyDeletefirst of all. you don't take the internet as serious business. How can you take something with so many misspellings as serious? lawl
ReplyDeletesecond. On the internet you don't know whoever you are talking to is who they say they are. Case and point, that story. So, if what you see is a facade and you don't have the capacity to see around the bend then that's your psychosis taking over your logic. This cyber bullying can be easily avoided with my simple remedy; Go outside and experience reality. There are things out there worse than "oh my god, zack effrom thinks i'm fat. i can just die". such as: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Junko_Furuta
Also, So what if we can pay for bills online? Fall in love online. Is this any different than using the post office or sending a mailed envelope? Another thing, the internet cannot teach one how to act morally. It cannot teach one how to make valid decisions. We are not in the cyberpunk age just yet, so take bitter online interactions with a grain of salt. fucking end
Perhaps because we still inherently reject the idea that the Internet is meant to be serious business. But when we develop legitimate a persona on a message board or whatnot, we have to play the game very seriously, or we won't be taken seriously.
ReplyDeleteDamn those music elitists. Art is opinion anyway.
ReplyDeleteAlan, the internet IS serious business. Obviously you have never been taunted online. You can also experience things online, so keep your philosophical babble about 'experiences' out. Sure, the outside world is beautiful and extraordinary to experience, but does not set limitations of what you can feel online.
ReplyDeleteI cannot concoct where you arrived to the idea that the internet is only used for "lols". Not everyone signs onto the internet to look up memes.
True, you do not always know who you are talking to, but I do not think you comprehend what I am referring to when I say 'cyberbullying'.
It goes much further than people telling you once that you are 'fat' or whatever it may be that they are utilizing to insult you. Most cases, when it is 'cyberbullying' and not just someone being a jackass, they do it repeatedly.
That is why Michelle Obama came up with the idea of a Megan Law, in tribute to the young girl who committed suicide after being attacked online various times.
Also, avoiding cyberbullies may not be a facile task as you perceive it to be. They will attack your emails, create web pages at your expense, edit your photos with crude things, etc.
A person should not leave what they enjoy doing (like blogging, signing up for forums, joining social networks) because they feel threatened by someone else.
Since you asked how sending out mail and paying your bills online is any different from each other, you have contradicted yourself. Since I can just ask, how is being bullied online any different than being bullied offline?
Of course the internet itself does not teach you morals. I do not know how you arrived to that idea from since I do not think I implied that. It is somewhat irrelevant to the specific topic I blogged about.
I'm going to add, Alan, that, please, next time you post take a minute to read my whole post, including scanning through the links I provided. Also, read comments previous to yours. Next, thoroughly think before you hit "post comment" so you can prevent looking like a jackass next time.
Also, thank you everyone else for sharing your thoughts. Aside from this, I can safely agree.
I see where you're coming from and i've read the opinions before, i don't fully agree with many of them. Let me emphasize more. This is in regards to cyber bullying. I remember an acquaintance of mine was blacklisting people they felt weren't up to their standards for one reason or another and weren't invited to trips, parties, etc., . I happily made the list. On top of that they 'trash talked' about people for laughs over group blogs. I was able to read some of their truths or conclusions made of the people. Let me say it was nasty. So i run into this person out on the street and he immediately assumes i'm ready to fight him. He was surprised when i invited him for coffee. I separate my internet 'life' from my real life. i felt no ill towards him or his group of friends because i have the logic to know what they write about is gossip and i just don't buy it, to be blunt. This is personal experience and is not an extreme case of trolling.
ReplyDeleteWhen people troll (bully) on the internet, in forums or chat, it is also not personal. They are against your opinion or words, not you personally. That's how i see it, so if i'm wrong thats a matter of opinion. When it's more direct it's different. In the case with the girl who committed suicide; the people that did it were acting on revenge but i'm sure they never thought she was in depression and would commit suicide. They were able to humiliate her but never encouraged her to kill herself. The prosecutor for that case was quoted as saying, "You don't normally send people to federal prison for annoying, bullying, or obnoxious conduct". The woman was found guilty of misdemeanors for trying to get information out of the girl but other than that no laws were broken.
So, if one was to try and stop online bullying or somehow punish someone for it they would have to take bigger measures. Currently people are protected online without punishment because of the 1st and 8th amendments. In order to dictate what cannot be said online you have to give personal information and this would be somewhat communist. Cyberpunk, or futuristic computerized societies, somewhat exist today. South Korea is a prime example. The BBC wrote an article about online bullying and how it will be fought. S Korea "will force Koreans to reveal their name and ID number before they share their opinions online." to prevent spread of information of a person. I don't see western countries adopting these any time soon.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/programmes/click_online/6112754.stm
Yes, but you are a 20, I think, year old male who would appear to be very childish if you cried over that or fight them. It sucks that had to happen to you. I do not think I would have just pretended like nothing happened and invited them for coffee, though. I would have just talked to them about it.
ReplyDeleteI'd also like to make the statement that there is a difference between trolling and bullying. Trolling is for the sole act of annoying people and amusing yourself. Bullying is more in depth and targets at the person.
I think the law, if I do remember correctly, that she broke was for faking the myspace. Whatever it was, I know it was not directly connected to the suicide.
I'm also aware they did not bully her to ignite the need for suicide. That is just a response to the bulliness.
Wait, how is that communist...? .....
>how is that communist...?
ReplyDeletebecause of the notion of Communism here in the usa. a red officer asking a citizen, "Papers comrade. Show them."
yes, i'm 20 pardner
and the word trolling is now also used to mean internet bullying.
Communist is equality for all, classless. Don't work? You get exiled. Doctors get the same pay as electricians, etc.
ReplyDeleteAccording to what?
Google trolling + cyber-bullying, the word is widely accepted to have various meanings.
ReplyDeleteI believe i can make the justifiable claim that you are my personal troll.
"An Internet troll, or simply troll in Internet slang, is someone who posts controversial, inflammatory, irrelevant or off-topic messages in an online community, such as an online discussion forum or chat room, with the primary intent of provoking other users into an emotional response[1] or to generally disrupt normal on-topic discussion."
ReplyDeleteI think things are becoming quite redundant.
>I think things are becoming quite redundant.
ReplyDeletethat's true. This relates to the belief that younger people are losing their core values in literature, and diction, because of technology. It is so widely acceptable for people to abbreviate or phonetically spell out words e.g., writing "Pleese, mistur" instead of the correct spelling.
also, i was reading this paper by a man named Allan Bloom and found an interesting quote that can relate to music elitist. You should read this, "Music, as everyone experiences, provides an unquestionable justification and a fulfilling pleasure for the activities it accompanies: the soldier who hears the marching band is enthralled and reassured; the religious man is exalted in his prayer by the sound of the organ in the church; and the lover is carried away and his conscience stilled by the romantic guitar. Armed with music, man can damn rational doubt. Out of the music emerge the gods that suit it, and they educate men by their example and their commandments" ... "To Plato and Nietzsche, the history of music is a series of attempts to give form and beauty to the dark, chaotic, premonitory forces in the soul-to make them serve a higher purpose, an ideal, to give man's duties a fullness". The people who are addicted to music serve their music. They pay little attention to what's going on because they just want to 'inject' themselves back in with the headphone jack. They are in a way blinded by the masturbatory sensation they get from their music. Music gives them everything they believe they lack, according to Bloom. Gabby, i think you walked into an orgy while it was getting rough, jokingly.
By what I meant by redundancy, was our discussion. Not kids with technology. Also, I again disagree with your standpoint.
ReplyDeleteTechnology is not to blame for "Pleese, mistur." If anything, technology makes literature, knowledge, information more accessible to one.
>technology makes literature, knowledge, information more accessible to one.
ReplyDeleteThat's true, but i'm talking about the youth. Teachers talk about how they get papers that are written as if it were a text message. I just found this article randomly that puts what i'm trying to say in a more understandable manner:
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/education/schools/education-quandary-textmessage-spelling-in-school-have-we-gone-mad-why-does-everything-have-to-be-made-so-easy-for-children-today-941098.html
How does technology being more accessible not pertain to the youth as well? Last time I checked, I'm considered a youth.
ReplyDeleteThe article doesn't really prove your point either.
It reads
"Children don't like things being made easy for them. We patronise them by thinking they do. My son loves learning his spelling lists. The harder the words, the better. "
"In fact, some research shows that texting seems to be making people more literate rather than less. For that we should all b v gr8ful. "
Ths is cmpty off tpic. But th3 prt about shakespear is prty intrstng huh? Lke, wht wuld it be like if we stll spke lke that? Well, i fnd it intrstng
ReplyDeleteJeesuss chrst ths convo d3clind in qualitee
ReplyDeleteYou know who I am, Gabby. I am the troll of the universe :)
ReplyDeleteI am that way in real life, to people that have the same attitude as the people I constantly trolled. Cunts that don't deserve the time of day, let alone the ability to breathe the same air I do. Does it piss them off in real life also? Yes. Do I care? Not one bit.
I think it's the people that troll just anyone that are in the wrong, but some people also deserve to be fucked with on account of attitude.
LBRS Brandon?
ReplyDeleteYes ma'am.
ReplyDeleteI didn't read the comments (and I'm very bored), but we've seen this happening since the dawn of forums. It only isolates those who are already poor socialists, because they grow vendettas against a certain brand of kids and feel they can unleash it on the forums, which only fuels their hate for these types, and further isolates them from others.
ReplyDeleteIt's bred from a deep rooted insecurity. You see it all the time on what. I say it plenty of times like the self help guru I like to imagine myself to be - confident people just don't feel the need to belittle others. There's a mirror effect within humans, and those who always see faults in others will consequently focus on their own faults themselves in moments of introspection and hate themselves. The self defense mechanism is to believe it exists outside of themselves - and try to attack it to kill it. As such, you have fools acting fools to each other on the forums. It goes way deeper than music snobbery. Humans are losing their value systems everyday, and are losing themselves to childlike behaviors.
joslinm